Should Health Care Be FREE Globally For Everyone?

[FranklinX 37]

Should Health Care Be FREE Globally For Everyone? 

 

We all get sick from time to time! It happens! Unfortunately, we will get an illness that can threaten our lives. We go to the doctor or the emergency room in extreme cases. Not everyone can afford the treatment to be cured or reduce the synonyms. 

 

If you are rich then you are in great shape! You can afford the best world-class treatments! Your fears are not as heavy as those who are unable to afford the world-class treatments. Instead they will die for the lack of treatment or for having treatments that are not the best. 

 

Do you know Magic Johnson? He has HIV and has lived for well over 20 years. He is a famous retired NBA Player and is part owner of the LA Dodgers. He can afford medicine and treatments that the average person cannot afford. His life has expanded because of his social status while others have died early in life because they were unable to afford Magic Johnson's treatments. To me this is not fair. Everyone should be given the same advanced treatments to live a healthy and fulfilling life. 

 

In my opinion it is murder to refuse someone health care because of their social status. How do people live with themselves when turning down people because they are unable to afford the best treatments? I couldn't do it. It is killing people. If you deny someone something that they need to live then you are basically killing them. 

 

Some doctors are simply greedy especially in America. We have doctors who are rich simply because they provide health care. I'm not talking about the plastic surgery doctors because they're not in this discussion. 

 

Capitalism kills in someways. The world needs a more socialistic approach towards health care. I am not 100% pro-socialism. I do believe it should be applied to health care for everyone to receive the best treatments. 

[Marked 197]

The world needs a more communistic approach towards health care. I am not 100% pro-communism. I do believe it should be applied to health care for everyone to receive the best treatments.

Ok you've got your wires seriously seriously crossed by saying free health care is a communist policy. That doesn't make sense. Here in New Zealand we have free care and our electoral system (MMP) is more democractic than that of the US several times over. But anyway, that's not particularly relevant to the discussion.

 

I agree with you that health care should be. You put globally in the title, but I believe it should be up to the particular to state to provide it for its citizens just like they do in a great many countries. These countries essentially realize that it should be a human right to have free healthcare. The US really leads the way for developed countries that refuse to sign international treaties (even though I'm not all for international law) that acknowledge certain human rights.

 

So that's my position. I'm probably bias because I found out last year that I am technically chronically ill, although I am optimistic about fighting my disease. I see a specialist every 6 weeks which is free. Without it and my current position in life (im still a student) I would be doing a lot worse, and would certainly die a lot quicker than I probably will. But that's never changed my opinion (I"m fine btw). To deny those who got the shit end of the stick (sick through no fault of their, poor through no fault of their own...) is disgusting. There's nothing that can out balance that. Oh taxes are too high... how about stop starting so many fucking wars. As a society we should all contribute to looking after our sick. That's fundamental for a society.

[FranklinX 37]

Ok you've got your wires seriously seriously crossed by saying free health care is a communist policy. That doesn't make sense. Here in New Zealand we have free care and our electoral system (MMP) is more democractic than that of the US several times over. But anyway, that's not particularly relevant to the discussion.

 

I agree with you that health care should be. You put globally in the title, but I believe it should be up to the particular to state to provide it for its citizens just like they do in a great many countries. These countries essentially realize that it should be a human right to have free healthcare. The US really leads the way for developed countries that refuse to sign international treaties (even though I'm not all for international law) that acknowledge certain human rights.

 

So that's my position. I'm probably bias because I found out last year that I am technically chronically ill, although I am optimistic about fighting my disease. I see a specialist every 6 weeks which is free. Without it and my current position in life (im still a student) I would be doing a lot worse, and would certainly die a lot quicker than I probably will. But that's never changed my opinion (I"m fine btw). To deny those who got the shit end of the stick (sick through no fault of their, poor through no fault of their own...) is disgusting. There's nothing that can out balance that. Oh taxes are too high... how about stop starting so many fucking wars. As a society we should all contribute to looking after our sick. That's fundamental for a society.

 

 

I didn't know you were ill. You'll be my in thoughts and prayers. I'm glad you're not here in the US. You would be shelling out thousands of dollars. 

 

The only law in the US that forces health care is Hospitals are not allowed to deny people at the emergency room if they don't have insurance. 

[Marked 197]

I didn't know you were ill. You'll be me in thoughts and prayers. I'm glad you're not here in the US. You would be shelling out thousands of dollars. 

Thanks, I appreciate that. At the moment I am fine, although the disease is potentially fatal and at best since I'm 23 it will shorten my life, and be debilitating in the end. But if someone could find a cure, that'd be great :) It's severity also varies and its very unpredictable so there's room for optimism. But my optimism relies pretty much on the hope that technology will advance. My brother also has it. It's made life a bunch more difficult, although he'll be a PhD in biochemistry in a few years, while I'll finish my law degree in a few months. We've got plans.

 

Interestingly, did you know that governments such as mine have agreements with pharmaceuticals not to find cures for diseases such as mine? It doesn't make a great deal of sense for a company to cure a disease, they just want to make drugs to make the symptoms better so they can sell that drug for the sick persons lifetime. If a cure were invented there would be no profit there, which is why governments, who should be concerned with its people and not its profits, should research cures. But they dont. So maybe I am screwed. Things have to change.

 

 

I didn't know you were ill. You'll be me in thoughts and prayers. I'm glad you're not here in the US. You would be shelling out thousands of dollars. 

 

The only law in the US that forces health care is Hospitals are not allowed to deny people at the emergency room if they don't have insurance. 

That's a practical law. It'd be way too heavily on the conscious to deny people. Question though, do you have to foot the bill afterward?

[FranklinX 37]

 

That's a practical law. It'd be way too heavily on the conscious to deny people. Question though, do you have to foot the bill afterward?

 

Yes, you must pay the bill if the insurance doesn't cover it or if you're uninsured. Uninsured people can't afford the bill of hospitals pass the costs down to patients by increasing hospital's cost. 

[Marked 197]

I guess the topic isn't so controversial. I wanted to argue with someone :( Are you guys scared of getting scolded by me?

[Rajaat99 3]

I'd like to interject and say there is no such thing as "free" health care. Someone is going to pay for it. If it's government run, it's the tax payers. I don't think health care should be government run.
For one, it opens the door to the type of corruption that you mentioned above, pharmaceutical companies have no interest in finding a cure and neither does the government. It's still about money, bribes to the politicians and tax payer dollars pouring into "health care" companies.
Also, secondly, I don't think my money should be taken from me to pay for someone elses health problems. Heck, why not have my money taken from me and given to someone to pay for their house? Shelter is necessary for survival more than health care is.
Now, this is not to say that I would not freely donate my money to help people poorer than I am, I have no problem with that and I donate money all the time. I just want to note that, here in the US, I'm living under the poverty line and I still freely give my money away.
Of course, I'm against the near monopoly that health insurance companies have as well. Here is the U.S. 2 insurance companies control 85 percent or more of the market (Blue Cross and United). They keep themselves at the top by buying politicians, who create regulations that force smaller companies to stay small and not offer the best care they can. Big pharmaceutical companies are guilty of this as well. That's not capitalism, that's corporatism.
To sum up my thoughts, I believe the majority of healthcare problems are caused by government intervention and cannot be solved by more government intervention.

[Marked 197]

'd like to interject and say there is no such thing as "free" health care

 Not at all :) There was literally no discussion. Always good to someone with different views, especially on a topic where I see no merit on the other side whatsoever.

 

For one, it opens the door to the type of corruption that you mentioned above, pharmaceutical companies have no interest in finding a cure and neither does the government. It's still about money, bribes to the politicians and tax payer dollars pouring into "health care" companies.

I completely disagree. "opens the door" = private was never corrupt in the first place. It's quite the opposite. If corruption was the issue, you would definitely go from private to public. Who is more corrupt, private companies (whose purpose is profit maximization) or the government? You may must be assuming you've got one hell of a corrupt government, and maybe you do, but its almost certainly a lot less corrupt than private run health business. Also, please refer to your own comments about the duopoly running health insurance.

 

no such thing as "free" health care. Someone is going to pay for it. If it's government run, it's the tax payers. I don't think health care should be government run.

That is taking the word free out of context. Everyone pays taxes. It is... its free in the sense its subsidized by government. It's not really a point of argument.

 

Also, secondly, I don't think my money should be taken from me to pay for someone elses health problems. Heck, why not have my money taken from me and given to someone to pay for their house? Shelter is necessary for survival more than health care is.

Now, this is not to say that I would not freely donate my money to help people poorer than I am, I have no problem with that and I donate money all the time. I just want to note that, here in the US, I'm living under the poverty line and I still freely give my money away.

I already touched on this in my post above. Health is a societal issue. If you got terminal cancer, would you say well shit that's unlucky, guess I'll just go die because I can't afford healthcare. Healthcare should be a human right because not everyone in society can afford it. One of the main purposes of government is to look after society. Shelter is not more necessary to survival than healthcare...dude, if you're dying? Do you care if you have a roof over your head? Health is the single most important thing a person can have, without it you don't have life. Why should anyone pay for you to go school? Or take a bus into town, or get a welfare benefit when you're country goes down the crapper and you can't get a job? This is your argument, except so much weaker because, why shouldn't your taxes go to preserving peoples health? It's more important than anything else.

 

To sum up my thoughts, I believe the majority of healthcare problems are caused by government intervention and cannot be solved by more government intervention.

You simply need to look at those countries who do have free healthcare. It works far better. There are no problems.

 

Ok keep posting, unless you're immune to ration, I will convince you. I kept my comments on "why should I pay for other peoples health" nice and succinct.

[Rajaat99 3]

Not at all :) There was literally no discussion. Always good to someone with different views, especially on a topic where I see no merit on the other side whatsoever.

I love having intelligent discussion.

 

I completely disagree. "opens the door" = private was never corrupt in the first place. It's quite the opposite. If corruption was the issue, you would definitely go from private to public. Who is more corrupt, private companies (whose purpose is profit maximization) or the government? You may must be assuming you've got one hell of a corrupt government, and maybe you do, but its almost certainly a lot less corrupt than private run health business. Also, please refer to your own comments about the duopoly running health insurance.

Woh, I never said private was never corrupt in the first place. It's just different when the government forces money from you and puts it in a corporations pocket. The very idea that corporations can bribe politicians shows that I think private companies are not any better. It's just that private companies cannot force you to do things, unlike the government.

The U.S. govrnment and certain major corporations are nearly indistinguishable, I cannot say one is corrupt and not the other.

 

That is taking the word free out of context. Everyone pays taxes. It is... its free in the sense its subsidized by government. It's not really a point of argument.

I'll disagree, it is a point of argument if my taxes go up to pay for it. The U.S. is horribly in debt, our government couldn't just pay for everyones healthcare and not raise taxes. Also, I may be mistaken, I understand that New Zealand isn't entirely "free" anyway, there are still co-pays and the like, is that correct?

 

I already touched on this in my post above. Health is a societal issue. If you got terminal cancer, would you say well shit that's unlucky, guess I'll just go die because I can't afford healthcare. Healthcare should be a human right because not everyone in society can afford it. One of the main purposes of government is to look after society. Shelter is not more necessary to survival than healthcare...dude, if you're dying? Do you care if you have a roof over your head? Health is the single most important thing a person can have, without it you don't have life. Why should anyone pay for you to go school? Or take a bus into town, or get a welfare benefit when you're country goes down the crapper and you can't get a job? This is your argument, except so much weaker because, why shouldn't your taxes go to preserving peoples health? It's more important than anything else.

Again, I disagree. Shelter is the most important thing. You can die from exposure in 15 minutes. Well, maybe not in the land of the long white cloud, I hear the weather out there is pristine.

Not everyone in society can afford shelter, or food, so it should it be provided by the government as well? I disagree that governments role is to "look after society." Governments job should be to ensure liberty.

Currently, our government offers government run healthcare for our military veterans. It's a mess. In order for it to not go overbudget, some of our elderly veterans go without the healthcare they were promised. Of course, younger, tax paying veterans get their healthcare, but the U.S. government sees the elderly military veterans as a drain on resources. It's sickening. I don't want that attitude for all of our elderly.

 

You simply need to look at those countries who do have free healthcare. It works far better. There are no problems.

I'll disagree with the "no problems." I know Canada has waiting lists for procendures and that sort of thing. However, that's not entirely my point anyway. Socialized healthcare may work fine in other countries, but the United States is not other countries. The United States government is corrupt, violent, and seeks to better politicians and their friends, not it's citizenry.

The FDA and the American Medical Association control nearly all aspects of the healthcare in the United States. They determine what is legal and that sort of thing. They are the major reason healthcare is so expensive in the United States right now. A couple of government run healthcare options in the U.S. refuse to pay for so-called "alternative medicine." Like chiropractic care, or the use of midwives during childbirth. If you aren't putting money in the FDA's or AMA's pockets, they won't pay for it.

Edited May 21, 2014 by Rajaat99