What's wrong with the RPG Maker Community?

[FranklinX 37]

All of the RPG Maker sites have lost activity. The RPG Maker Community is facing many issues.

 

1. Everyone wants to own a site. People like the spotlight. This is not very good. This dilutes sites' activity. It's watering down active membership. We all can't be at every forum at the same time. There should only be a few forums. This way more people will be able to help each other make awesome games.

 

2. Rudeness is very common at many RPG Maker sites. It's not just members, admins and mods on many sites are very disrespectful to their members. It is very unattractive for a forum to have its' staff insult people. It makes people think twice before joining such sites.

 

3. There are too many unrealistic projects. I understand people want to make the game that will earn them respect. However, most games are very unrealistic. There are far too many projects being canceled left and right because they are far too unrealistic.

 

4. Too many people are making teams. Making a team is never a good idea. 99.999999% of the people only know each other online. Things happen in life that may prevent people from working long term for a team.

 

5. This goes back to point 3 and 4. People need to learn the basics. We all will be awful developers at the start. More developers will need to first focus on tutorials. It may be best to make a short game to learn the basic concepts of the program.

[Kiriashi 117]

All of the RPG Maker sites have lost activity. The RPG Maker Community is facing many issues.

 

1. Everyone wants to own a site. People like the spotlight. This is not very good. This dilutes sites' activity. It's watering down active membership. We all can't be at every forum at the same time. There should only be a few forums. This way more people will be able to help each other make awesome games.

 

Hmm. I agree that there are too many. There should only be one, and I have one in mind. :P

 

2. Rudeness is very common at many RPG Maker sites. It's not just members, admins and mods on many sites are very disrespectful to their members. It is very unattractive for a forum to have its' staff insult people. It makes people think twice before joining such sites.

 

Good thing no-one at Unlimited is rude. :3 Why do you care if other sites are? This is the only site that matters. We must dominate all the others!

 

3. There are too many unrealistic projects. I understand people want to make the game that will earn them respect. However, most games are very unrealistic. There are far too many projects being canceled left and right because they are far too unrealistic.

 

..Errmm... what? Since when do RPGs of all games need to be realistic? I doubt the type of projects on a site have anything to do with its quality. But I do think that frequent canceling of games causes site to go inactive.

 

4. Too many people are making teams. Making a team is never a good idea. 99.999999% of the people only know each other online. Things happen in life that may prevent people from working long term for a team.

 

Making a team is never a good idea? Why not? Loads of people work better in a team..

 

5. This goes back to point 3 and 4. People need to learn the basics. We all will be awful developers at the start. More developers will need to first focus on tutorials. It may be best to make a short game to learn the basic concepts of the program.

 

Hmm.. Good points, but not really reflective of a site as a whole, wouldn't you say?

 

 

...btw you weren't talking about this site right?

[Arkbennett 16]

I agree with this.

[ProjectTrinity 8]

"If you care about your project at all - you'll listen to this person's critique without asking questions" -HBGames.org sponsor.

 

The person was a zidiot, regardless. Told him to stop circling in his argument and solve his issues and he didn't listen. I told him to leave my thread if all he wanted to do was argue rather than critique...and he left the thread. Goodness. ' -'

 

I agree with number 2. I don't know what's the big problem, but people need more pride in their staff. Also, I need a team. I do far, far more than RMXP my creativity. =p

[Marked 197]

I can't stand people being assholes and I can't stand bullies, so I think we're good on that front. A lot of sites just let in happen. Perhaps it would drive some people away? Either way, websites need to be moderated and rules need to be upheld.

 

Two things that stuck for me is everyone wanting to be a site owned and team projects. I don't think people are wanting to start their sites anymore because they rarely get anywhere in the current state of the RM community. Also with teams, we have gotten so many complete newbies starting up team projects. Some don't even have an existing project. They never get anywhere (the newbies, not teams).

[kellessdee 48]

..Errmm... what? Since when do RPGs of all games need to be realistic? I doubt the type of projects on a site have anything to do with its quality. But I do think that frequent canceling of games causes site to go inactive.

 

I think he meant unrealistic as in the goals, or expected outcome...like the makers being too ambitious for their own good.

 

I am not sure if that will cause a site to go inactive (directly anyways), but I can see this possibly causing a drop in people who play rpg maker games, and thus a drop in popularity overall.

 

Which is another main contributing factor I believe to the current state of the Rpg Maker Communities; How can the community be active if that which they support/promote's popularity is fading?

 

And of course, like everyone has said, the way members treat each other can be a HUGE issue. Like I have always said I hate the elitist attitude that a lot of Rpg Maker (all rpg makers) users display. I am sorry if this offends anyone, but how can you be an elite game developer working with Rpg maker? There is nothing wrong with using it of course, and great games can be made in Rpg maker, but seriously with it's current limits and what not, how can it really be considered much more than a hobby? It's probably a great stepping stone (maybe another reason it has lost popularity, people leaving for more powerful engines or other game libraries) but I just don't see how they develop an elitist attitude. I doubt you see anything like that among actual commercial game developers (and they are actually competing for sales) I think people need to learn to accept the fact that everyone is a noob at some point, how can you possibly be good at something the first time you use it? Unless you were scripting 1337 action battle systems straight from the womb, you have no right to bash another user because you proclaim yourself to be better.

 

Of course, on the other hand of things; there are those out there who need to learn how to take constructive criticism. I know for some it's hard to find out that the concept they were working on isn't as awesome as they thought; but if you want people to enjoy your game they should take people's advice and work on it. And even if they don't take that advice, there is no sense in getting angry and defensive (it's not worth it, arguing over whether one's idea is great or not with someone you will never meet in real life...and even if you do; it's still not worth it)

 

[/rant]

 

Anywho, just some more thoughts. It's not easy to pin the blame for the current state of the RPG Maker World on a specific set of factors; since it is clearly a plethora of different things. I am afraid to say I also highly doubt it will get better, unless Enterbrain comes out with a new maker (even then) which is also unlikely considering the current popularity of the rpg makers (who knows though, maybe it's more popular in japan, and they will still find a new english version worth releasing)

 

Thankfully I found this great community :alright: so as Kiri stated: RMXPU is awesome and that's all that matters. (to paraphrase)

[Kiriashi 117]

Oh I assure you kell, there will be a new product by Enterbrain. Maybe not another RPG Maker, (here's to hoping it will be!) but they'll come out with something new. AGM was pretty much a flop, so they must mend their ways! xD

[kellessdee 48]

(here's to hoping it will be!)

 

Yea, i think they should stick to the rpg maker series, they were on the right path; if they just focus on the drawbacks they could easily create the perfect rpg maker. *crosses fingers* lets hope they do it right :)

[Kiriashi 117]

I know, its really disappointing, 'cause if those guys put their minds to it, they really could have a perfect (or close to it) RM. RMXP was done right, it just needed improvements. As for VX.. Well... I'm not a fan of those sprites. But the system runs so much smoother. .-.

 

And it looks like I just missed you in chat.. Darn it.

[Noob Saibot 38]

All of the RPG Maker sites have lost activity. The RPG Maker Community is facing many issues.

 

1. Everyone wants to own a site. People like the spotlight. This is not very good. This dilutes sites' activity. It's watering down active membership. We all can't be at every forum at the same time. There should only be a few forums. This way more people will be able to help each other make awesome games.

 

People get a wild hair and go with it. Even I once had a RMXP/VX site, but gave up on it. I then began looking into other options and I have had a few ideas (one of which was quite popular, I just need to get off my a$$ and start it.

 

2. Rudeness is very common at many RPG Maker sites. It's not just members, admins and mods on many sites are very disrespectful to their members. It is very unattractive for a forum to have its' staff insult people. It makes people think twice before joining such sites.

 

Well you can either be the bigger person and ignore it or leave. Over time it will force people to change how they run a community.

 

3. There are too many unrealistic projects. I understand people want to make the game that will earn them respect. However, most games are very unrealistic. There are far too many projects being canceled left and right because they are far too unrealistic.

 

I believe any thing is possible, but it is just improbable. So with that being said, people have a lack of experience and knowledge to take on projects that are more suited for a veteran maker.

 

4. Too many people are making teams. Making a team is never a good idea. 99.999999% of the people only know each other online. Things happen in life that may prevent people from working long term for a team.

 

When I got into game making (as a hobbyist) I still treated it as if I wasn't a hobbyist and bought a variety of books to better help me work with a team, find the time, etc. It's all based on how bad and series you want it and will take it.

 

Secrets of the Game Business, 2nd Ed.

Business and Production: A GameDev.net Collection

Team Leadership in the Game Industry

The Game Production Handbook, Second Edition

Game Development Essentials: Game Project Management

Audio for Games: Planning, Process, and Production

 

Now if your serious about making a game and having a team then I should not see any excuses like, "I don't have the money." Because it's called a Job (USA averages 15-16 to hold a part time job).

 

5. This goes back to point 3 and 4. People need to learn the basics. We all will be awful developers at the start. More developers will need to first focus on tutorials. It may be best to make a short game to learn the basic concepts of the program.

 

I have never made a working, functioning game in RMXP/VX or Game Maker, but I still know how to use them to help people.

 

Hmm. I agree that there are too many. There should only be one, and I have one in mind. :P

 

Leave it to Kiriashi to not have a serious answer.

 

Good thing no-one at Unlimited is rude. :3 Why do you care if other sites are? This is the only site that matters. We must dominate all the others!

 

I like RMXP Unlimited, but the reality of it is that RMXP Unlimited doesn't have ALL the RESOURCES or SCRIPTS that people may need. So your answer is flawed at best (no offense Marked).

 

..Errmm... what? Since when do RPGs of all games need to be realistic? I doubt the type of projects on a site have anything to do with its quality. But I do think that frequent canceling of games causes site to go inactive.

 

To compete even Hobbyists should take their projects serious as if they where working in the industry!

 

Making a team is never a good idea? Why not? Loads of people work better in a team..

 

Some people can't handle it!

 

Hmm.. Good points, but not really reflective of a site as a whole, wouldn't you say?

 

...btw you weren't talking about this site right?

 

Depends on the site.

 

I agree with this.

 

Perhaps, but research goes a long way!

 

"If you care about your project at all - you'll listen to this person's critique without asking questions" -HBGames.org sponsor.

 

The person was a zidiot, regardless. Told him to stop circling in his argument and solve his issues and he didn't listen. I told him to leave my thread if all he wanted to do was argue rather than critique...and he left the thread. Goodness. ' -'

 

I agree with number 2. I don't know what's the big problem, but people need more pride in their staff. Also, I need a team. I do far, far more than RMXP my creativity. =p

 

I think most people know that the history of that community is staled with the ignorance of a rock every now and then.

 

I can't stand people being assholes and I can't stand bullies, so I think we're good on that front. A lot of sites just let in happen. Perhaps it would drive some people away? Either way, websites need to be moderated and rules need to be upheld.

 

Two things that stuck for me is everyone wanting to be a site owned and team projects. I don't think people are wanting to start their sites anymore because they rarely get anywhere in the current state of the RM community. Also with teams, we have gotten so many complete newbies starting up team projects. Some don't even have an existing project. They never get anywhere (the newbies, not teams).

 

I think if someone want to start one, they truly have to make a Game Making/Development site and not focus on one software. But again if the person has never used Stencyl then their site may fail. After all who wants to join a community where the knowledge of the staff is limited.

 

Not to mention no matter what site/community you wish to make you will need the basics of advertising your site. If you can do this then you can greatly improve your chances of being a site/community that survives.

 

I think he meant unrealistic as in the goals, or expected outcome...like the makers being too ambitious for their own good.

 

Agreed...to some degree.

 

I am not sure if that will cause a site to go inactive (directly anyways), but I can see this possibly causing a drop in people who play rpg maker games, and thus a drop in popularity overall.

 

Anything is possible.

 

Which is another main contributing factor I believe to the current state of the Rpg Maker Communities; How can the community be active if that which they support/promote's popularity is fading?

 

I think it's more people grow up; not that making games is for kids, but more along the lines that they start having different interests and goals in life.

 

And of course, like everyone has said, the way members treat each other can be a HUGE issue. Like I have always said I hate the elitist attitude that a lot of Rpg Maker (all rpg makers) users display. I am sorry if this offends anyone, but how can you be an elite game developer working with Rpg maker? There is nothing wrong with using it of course, and great games can be made in Rpg maker, but seriously with it's current limits and what not, how can it really be considered much more than a hobby? It's probably a great stepping stone (maybe another reason it has lost popularity, people leaving for more powerful engines or other game libraries) but I just don't see how they develop an elitist attitude. I doubt you see anything like that among actual commercial game developers (and they are actually competing for sales) I think people need to learn to accept the fact that everyone is a noob at some point, how can you possibly be good at something the first time you use it? Unless you were scripting 1337 action battle systems straight from the womb, you have no right to bash another user because you proclaim yourself to be better.

 

I think it's a sense of people feeling that other people should know what to do. Things that they find simple to do (i.e. a chest to stay open) they assume others should understand it. Or that everyone should actually read through old and outdated topics to find the answer.

 

A lot of people also use Google as an excuse and subject newbies to the old, "did you use google or the search on the forum?" Which in reality this goes against the point of a community/site that allows member to member support.

 

I think overall people need to stop doing this and just answer the question regardless if it can be found in an old topic or a pinned FAQ.

 

Of course, on the other hand of things; there are those out there who need to learn how to take constructive criticism. I know for some it's hard to find out that the concept they were working on isn't as awesome as they thought; but if you want people to enjoy your game they should take people's advice and work on it. And even if they don't take that advice, there is no sense in getting angry and defensive (it's not worth it, arguing over whether one's idea is great or not with someone you will never meet in real life...and even if you do; it's still not worth it)

 

This is true, but also some people need to learn to take it, use it, and apply it instead of getting butt hurt!

 

Anywho, just some more thoughts. It's not easy to pin the blame for the current state of the RPG Maker World on a specific set of factors; since it is clearly a plethora of different things. I am afraid to say I also highly doubt it will get better, unless Enterbrain comes out with a new maker (even then) which is also unlikely considering the current popularity of the rpg makers (who knows though, maybe it's more popular in japan, and they will still find a new english version worth releasing)

 

I disagree. Enterbrain is a business. They will let it ride and when people least expect it we will see a new maker.

 

Thankfully I found this great community :alright: so as Kiri stated: RMXPU is awesome and that's all that matters. (to paraphrase)

 

Not true and I'm sure Marked can agree. This community is only as good as what it offers. Any site, no matter what the content has room for improvement. I'm sure Marked even knows this.

 

Yea, i think they should stick to the rpg maker series, they were on the right path; if they just focus on the drawbacks they could easily create the perfect rpg maker. *crosses fingers* lets hope they do it right :)

 

No this is bad business practice. If they want to compete with other makers (free or commercial) they need to make more then just RPG Makers.

Edited June 21, 2011 by Noob Saibot

[kellessdee 48]

I disagree. Enterbrain is a business. They will let it ride and when people least expect it we will see a new maker.

 

Well, I do hope you are right. I think we were lucky to even get an official translation of XP/VX, but you are probably right here. I am not a business man :)

 

Not true and I'm sure Marked can agree. This community is only as good as what it offers. Any site, no matter what the content has room for improvement. I'm sure Marked even knows this.

 

I never said there isn't room for improvement, and marked does know this as do I. However, I still think this is an awesome community, the people/users make up the community, content makes up the site. We may not have the MOST content, but I think overall the users here are awesome and thus I believe this community is awesome (mind you, I haven't been here THAT long.)

 

No this is bad business practice. If they want to compete with other makers (free or commercial) they need to make more then just RPG Makers.

 

While you are right here as well...look at Action Game Maker (or whatever).... It may be bad business practice in terms of competition, but I think they either need to rethink their approach to other Game Makers, or just stick to what they are good at.

 

EDIT: Btw, you do make very good points.

[gRaViJa 4]

I agree with you except for point 4: I'm working with a team of people for a long time now, and we still all work on Ascension. Everyone just need to know that someone a teammember will stop, but if you are serious enough, you will find a replacement. Problem is indeed that many project are not serious enough for seriosuly commited people to join.

[Broken Messiah 20]

I used to like the idea of teams, but I find that I get things done if I do it myself. I do notice a lot of newer users of rpgmaker wanting to make the next big epic game and that's not entirely their fault. They see what enterbrain has written about their programs requiring no skill and no scripting* knowledge and the rtp is the greatest thing since sliced bread and think they can make a great game in no time.

 

*Anyone who has played Knightblade will tell you that Enterbrain did not use any of there default resources and there was a script in thier, so why would we want to use it

[Kiriashi 117]

Leave it to Kiriashi to not have a serious answer.

I like RMXP Unlimited, but the reality of it is that RMXP Unlimited doesn't have ALL the RESOURCES or SCRIPTS that people may need. So your answer is flawed at best (no offense Marked).

To compete even Hobbyists should take their projects serious as if they where working in the industry!

 

Excuse me? It was a completely serious answer; just with a optimistic tone. To me this IS the only site that matters. How is my "answer" flawed? We do our very best to improve and will continue doing so until we're at the top.

 

 

 

As for it not being true that RMXP Unlimited is all that matters... whaaaat? Nobody said that there isn't room for improvement.

[Rose 3]

I also agree I wisely listened to alot of tuts and still do(mianly about scripts)

 

The rudness or just emptyness of sites can be a bugger.

I once got trolled off of blizzards site just for being named rose [apparently there was no more room in their tiny brians for another rose}very confrontational bunch.

 

The best two sites Ive found were Save-point and this one here. RRR is simply to big for me I cant do the omg look at all the people type sites.

[Noob Saibot 38]

Excuse me? It was a completely serious answer; just with a optimistic tone.

 

See here is an example of getting butt hurt over someones opinion.

 

To me this IS the only site that matters.

 

Your opinion.

 

How is my "answer" flawed? We do our very best to improve and will continue doing so until we're at the top.

 

Thinking you are the best and being the best are two different things. RMXP Unlimited (RMXPU herein refereed as) is like any other RMXP Community, untill you add or do something that sets you apart from other communities you can never be the best. Even then if you where the "best" you RMXPU still would not be the best because perfection is fictional in itself.

[kellessdee 48]

Noob saibot: Did you really have to split kiriashi's post up like that to make essentially the same post?

 

Leave it to Kiriashi to not have a serious answer.

Excuse me? It was a completely serious answer; just with a optimistic tone.

How is he getting butthurt? he is clearly responding to your idea that he wasn't being serious. Explaining one's actions != butthurt.

 

 

But anyways, Not once did ANYONE say Rmxpu is the best, or even perfect. We said it's awesome here (hence why we are still here) and we also said it's the only site that matters. to us. And why wouldn't it? I am not an active member anywhere else, Kiri's been here a long + administrator.

 

All in all, this argument is going nowhere, because there is no argument. No one is denying the fact that RMXPU could use improvement, yet you keep bringing it up as if it's relevant to the conversation. Kiri said we could use improvement, I have said there is room for improvement, as there always will be. So I really don't see what point you are trying to make here.

 

Like you said, us thinking this site is awesome is our opinion, and we never said it was fact; it's just how we feel about the site. If you feel differently, that's fair: you are entitled to your opinion just as much as we are, just as much as ANY other member on the site.

 

No one's butthurt. I don't want a fight to start over this, as essentially EVERYTHING in this thread is simply opinion. Yes, there is fact here and there; but when it comes down to what makes a good rmxp community; what would be the best rmxp community is completely subjective.

[Marked 197]

Yeah anyway, enough of that argument. You always run into trouble in a conflict when the interpretation of what one or the other meant, etc. I mean if I were to do that, I'd say something like: when Kiriashi says 'to me its the best' then thats not an opinion, because thats a fact of preference. Now was Kiriashi referring to his preference or stating his opinion that the site is the best? See my point, its pointless.

 

I like RMXP Unlimited, but the reality of it is that RMXP Unlimited doesn't have ALL the RESOURCES or SCRIPTS that people may need. So your answer is flawed at best (no offense Marked).

None taken, we certainly do not have all the resources and scripts that people may need.

Not true and I'm sure Marked can agree. This community is only as good as what it offers. Any site, no matter what the content has room for improvement. I'm sure Marked even knows this.

I suppose a site is about content, but it can be taken a lot further. It's a huge coincidence that I ended up in charge of a site that lasted 5 years. But I'm sill learning a lot of new things about how to improve user experience and the functions of a 'community'. I did realize that RMXPU has many more room for improvement than normal, in fact I could almost describe the last year or two as depreciation of the site. But I got things in the works.

Thinking you are the best and being the best are two different things. RMXP Unlimited (RMXPU herein refereed as) is like any other RMXP Community, untill you add or do something that sets you apart from other communities you can never be the best.

I don't think we're like any other RPG Maker community.

[Kiriashi 117]

Being set apart from the lot is something Marked, me and every other member of the staff -- and plenty of regular members too -- strive to retain. And frankly, I'm pretty darn sure we are different. :3

 

EDIT: I removed the majority of this posts because I don't think this topic can see any progression from me defending the site.

[FranklinX 37]

It sure is tough times. It's like the rpg maker recession. It's gonna take drastic measures to save this (rmxpunlimited) site.

 

It's weird though because I don't see a reason why people arnt making games anymore. Perhaps there's better software out there?

 

This comment caught my eye. It was posted in another topic. I'm unable see any reason why people aren't making games. The RPG Maker does not need programing. Most developmental software requires programing knowledge.